SPEAKER_01 0:00

I have just been very overwhelmed and struggling just to function and find systems and just get rid of so much of the stuff that's in this house. I really need help.

SPEAKER_00 0:10

Welcome to What Are You Making Space For? I'm Star Hansen, certified professional organizer, trauma-informed coach, and clutter whisperer. For more than 20 years, I've seen firsthand that getting organized is almost never about the stuff. Clutter's just the start. Every space tells a story. And behind every pile of clutter, you'll find life transitions, grief, trauma, perfectionism, relationships, dreams we've outgrown, and sometimes the dreams we're just beginning to imagine. On this podcast, we'll step inside real organizing sessions to explore what our belongings are trying to tell us, why we get stuck, and what we're ready to make space for next. These episodes come directly from virtual organizing sessions with people who have generously invited us into their organizing journey by agreeing to share their stories on this podcast. Whether you're hoping to clear a closet, understand yourself a little bit better, or simply feel less alone, I'm glad you're here. Let's find out what we're making space for today. On this week's episode, we're going to meet Lainey. I've known Lainey's sister for years, and when I started looking for people to be a part of the podcast, her sister reached out and asked if I'd consider working with Lainey. And I'm so glad she did. Lainey's a stay-at-home mom with an almost two-year-old daughter. She's creative, she's starting a business, and there's a storage room in her house that she's been struggling with for years. She wants it to become a place where she can work, make art, and still store everything her family needs it to hold. So that's where we started. Meet Lainey.

SPEAKER_01 1:51

And I am 37, I think. Grown up in Santa Cruz, Monterey area. I am a mom to one daughter. She's almost two, and I live with my partner, and we've been together about seven years. I have uh always worked with kids. It's my passion. I love working with kids. I'm very creative. I like to do art. I'm working on starting a business where I can work with kids and teach classes. And that's kind of where I am as a stay-at-home mom right now. When I met my partner and moved in, it was right around COVID. And so I moved into his house that he's been in for a long time. It was a very unofficial move in because of COVID. And so I slowly started bringing more and more of my stuff in. And I have ADHD. All my life I've had tools and different ways of dealing with things, but now that I'm in someone else's space and there's other things here. And now I'm a mom, I have just been very overwhelmed and struggling just to function and find systems and just get rid of so much of the stuff that's in this house. I really need help. Tell me about the space you want to work on. This is our storage room. You can't even function in here. So this is very, very challenging. Like I need somebody to hold my hand to do this room kind of thing. And it's like a storage room. It has like all the Costco stuff that we keep. Yeah. We don't have a garage. So, like in that corner over there is all the fishing pools. And then the car seat, which we want to have another kid's. So I don't want to get rid of the car seat. Some things I'm okay with getting rid of, like some of the I would like to sell. There's a bunch of stuff in this room that I've been planning on selling. Just the thought of this room is overwhelming to me. This is not just storage. Well, it is storage, obviously, but I have a lot of art supplies and just craft stuff and just a lot of things. I'm trying to start a business and I don't have anywhere to sit and close a door and work.

SPEAKER_00 3:45

You should be very proud of how much you fit into this space. It's a real workhorse space. So often people focus on what's not working rather than what is working. And clutter actually makes us overlook what's working. So I think it's worth taking a minute to acknowledge how functional this space has been for Lainey and her family. In spite of all of the challenges, in spite of the frustrations and the overwhelm, there's a lot that this room is doing right. What are you making space for?

SPEAKER_01 4:16

Oh, I would like to have a space to do art and be creative. And this room has like a really cute corner with windows. It gets a lot of light. It looks into our backyard. And so I dream of being able to put a desk over there and a space to do work stuff, but also a space for art and a space for all my art supplies to be organized so I can be creative. Since I had my daughter, it was like for a long time I didn't even feel the urge to create anything. But now she's almost two and it's coming back. And I'm like so excited to try and do stuff again, but I have no space to do it. And it still needs to be a storage room, but it needs to have a system that we can continue to use and that will be effective. So that's the hope is that I'll have a space for myself to work and have an office area and an art area as well as a storage area.

SPEAKER_00 5:10

I love it. So how do you feel when you're in that room?

SPEAKER_01 5:13

Stressed. Stress. Totally stressed. Like yeah, like it's just frustrating and I don't want to think about it at all. Like I just want to not talk about or think about it is easier than to try to deal with it. I think a lot of times it's just the time and takes for us to try to do stuff like this is not very common. We don't find the time, especially with me with having our daughter. Our schedules are different. He's working too. He gets home from work, he's tired, he doesn't really want to do it on a workday. But we also don't want to do it on a weekend because we'd rather just be together on the weekend. So I procrastinate too. I just, I don't feel like I can come in this room and just do it by myself.

SPEAKER_00 5:52

When you're working on a space like this, how many hours would you say you normally have available to work on this project when you're by yourself?

SPEAKER_01 6:01

I mean, I won't do it unless I have at least like two hours. And that won't even really feel like a dent, honestly.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

A job like that would also take me multiple days as a professional, you know, so you're not off base.

SPEAKER_01 6:12

Yeah. It's hard. Yeah. Anything that would be done in those two hours would be undone in the following week, like, you know, until I found time again.

SPEAKER_00 6:22

Yeah. Thank you for sharing all of that. And what I vision when I hear you talk about the space and when I see the space is we need the highest level version of what this room is going to be. What's tricky with clutter is when we address the clutter from the clutter, like when we go into a room and we just start to dig into the clutter, we let the clutter direct us. What I want to do is I want to start from a different perspective than you normally do of like, okay, high level, what are the three to five things you want to use this room for? So office is one, right? Craft stuff.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

And it is storage. I just like looking at what's in here and the boxes. There's so many boxes of my just art supplies. And there's a lot of them that could easily be condensed. I know my system has been when I want to work on something. So I want to work on watercolor, I dig out all the watercolor stuff and I end up putting it in a box because I'm the kind of person who will work on a project and leave it out for a few days. And when I'm ready, I'll put it away, or it'll just get piled up, right? So I have so many just things in all these boxes. And when I look at it, I'm like, it's just a lot.

SPEAKER_00 7:31

But you know what? I love my art supplies. So what I hear so far is we need this to be set up as a craft area, an office space, a Costco slash households overflow storage, a cram space. Like you need somewhere that your ADHD can just like hang out free and wild, and you don't have to have it tidied up. You need to have safe spaces where you are allowed to let it all hang out.

SPEAKER_01 7:53

My mental health has been really like up and down, up and down. And I'm realizing like the environment and not having that space is such a big part of it. Yeah. Yeah. Because I shouldn't be living in a fantasy where I'm waiting for us to buy a house and I get to move in and start fresh. Like that shouldn't be the way I'm thinking and like just sitting here miserable until then, right? Because we don't know when that's gonna happen, hopefully sooner or later, but I have to be able to function here. And then it's like it's just affecting me so much. And I'm like, oh, how amazing would it be if I could just go and plan an activity with her or do a craft with her and like not have to worry about all the prep and cleanup that is so time consuming that I just don't do it.

unknown 8:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:35

And I dreamed my whole life of doing things with my kid, and now she's old enough, she's almost two, so I can actually start doing stuff with her. But the chore of doing anything is hard because I don't know where my things are.

SPEAKER_00 8:45

And like, look, let's just name what's true, which is you bring creativity and inspiration and excitement and joy. That's not small. That doesn't get put into a tiny little side closet that needs space to live.

SPEAKER_01 8:58

It feels good to hear somebody say that and make it feel like a positive thing because I get called messy. And all my friends know, like, if I'm coming, I'm gonna take up space. No matter if I'm going to your house, I have stuff always with me, and it's always gonna take up some space. And it's just how I am, and I've accepted it. It doesn't really bother me, but it bothers other people. And so hearing you right now, reframe that in a positive way, like it's part of me and my personality, and that's okay because it's I have everything you need. Whatever you need, I've got it.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

And it's like I I love it. I love that about you. I mean, it's we've known each other for 37 minutes, and I work with neurospicy people all the time. But it's to me, you all are the most fabulous, most interesting people because you are you're prepared for a lot of things due to your own experience, and you also are deeply interested and curious. Your house should be a place where you are allowed to be all of who you are. And and yeah, I'm never gonna want you to shrink and hide. I want you to take up more space. Because to me, you taking up more space is what will stop the clutter from happening. So I can see you looking around and I can see you trying to figure out where do we start. I'll tell you where we start. So we already started because we start first and foremost by setting the intention of the space. From there, we started working on the room. We moved a few things out, went through a bag of donations, and started to create a little bit more space. It wasn't a dramatic transformation, but it was a start. And before we finished, I gave Lainey one small assignment to work on before we met again. Shoes. I didn't want her trying to organize the whole room on her own. Her homework was to just go through her shoes. The reason why I gave her this assignment was because she seemed genuinely interested and excited about working on her shoes. And when we have that kind of excitement, it makes the project go so much more smoothly. But I know that often the projects that we're excited about do carry with them even more layers than we expect. So I also wanted to make sure that she understood that I was here to support her as she went along with it. And I told her that anything that felt easy, she could make a decision about, and anything that felt hard, she could save for me and we'd work through it together. A couple of weeks later, we met again to see how it went. So since we saw each other, how have you been doing? How have things been feeling? How's the room changed since we took last?

SPEAKER_01 11:15

Originally, you know, I felt really good and I was really motivated. And I started working on stuff in another room and like I don't know, just felt motivated and I felt a weight off my shoulders knowing that, you know, I had help. And so it was great. I had homework from you that was to work on my shoes, and that was in the back of my head every day since we last met. And I procrastinated it until yesterday. So I started pulling out the shoes and I was like, oh my gosh, there's so much here. And I was trying to like make the decisions, and I'm like, I have to try a lot of these on and see if they're even comfortable anymore. And then I kind of just got overwhelmed and was like, you know what? I'm just gonna get them out, put them in a pile, and I think I need to just ask Star for help with this. Randomly, I had some time. My sister had my daughter, and so I was like, what can I do right now? I'm gonna do what everyone's been telling me and just do one small task. It doesn't have to be the whole thing. And so I've had all these bags of clothes that are in this room that were from my aunt's garage, and they were from when me and my sisters were little kids, and then when my cousins were little kids, and so it's a lot of vintage clothes. And I randomly was in here and I saw something that was really cute and that would fit my daughter. And I'm like, oh, I need to go through this bag because it's stuff that's her size right now, and I need clothes that fit her. And so I pulled out one of the big bags, I took it out and I went through it all. I have a whole bag of stuff that needs to be washed that I want to keep. But then I had a trash bag and a donate bag. And when my sister came and brought my daughter home, I was like, I need you to take this out and go take it to Goodwill, please, or go donate it. So I did do that, which is a big accomplishment.

SPEAKER_00 13:01

That's a huge accomplishment. It's funny, a room like what you're dealing with that we call it a lot of times the room of doom. And one of the reasons why it feels so overwhelming is because there's not one or two things you need to do. There's like a thousand mini projects that are in that room. And so, yeah, you did all the right things. You picked a project that felt manageable, you solicited help. I couldn't have asked for anything more than that. And you answered, I was gonna ask you, you know, it's so common with my ADHDers to do everything except the thing I told them to do. Like, I'll be like, do this one thing and they'll do everything else. And I'm like, well, good news, we got everything else done. That's great. But it's so funny. I was gonna say, well, what'd you do instead? Of because you said you kept doing yes. Like, what'd you do instead? Because I've never seen anyone not do anything. They just do something else that feels more interesting, more novel, more fun, more exactly. Yeah, yeah. So the fact that you pick something that had some meat to it, it was like, oh yeah, I can make some effort on this because it's like you need to be able to see a difference as well. When we look at these small projects, we also need like a visual or energetic component that we can feel because if we can, it feels very deflating, I think, in a lot of ways.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

Yeah, I mean, looking in here, I don't think anyone can tell. And I was kind of disappointed. I can't really even tell. I took a bag out of there because there's a hole back there, but you can't really tell. But you can see the bag of clothes that I'm keeping. And so I have that. I'm like, I did go through stuff, and it is hard. If you don't have something to see, like I want to feel proud of what I did. And I did feel proud, I was super proud. I told my partner right when he got home. But there's so much in here that it really felt like a little small thing, even though it was a big thing.

SPEAKER_00 14:38

You know, I love that you did something so smart because you found something that was interesting to you that could compel you to really engage yourself with it. And we move really quickly when we're very interested in things. This is relevant to your life. And so it's really important to track that we want to focus on the relevant things. When we're organizing in the home, I want you doing the easiest things first and the things that give you a sense of energy. Because if we start with the hard stuff, it's so easy to burn out and it's so easy to just feel deflated by the whole process. And so you did the right thing by finding something that was easy, but also fun because you knew what you wanted from it. And then again, I cannot commend you enough that you chose to ask for help because you know it's hard for you to leave the house anyways with the toddler, certainly to do donations. Most people, those things ride around in the back of the car until they need a seatbelt because they're alive with their own life force energy. So the fact that you asked for help was very smart because it's moving you forward. And that's something so easy your sister could have done, I'm sure, that would have felt really stressful for you. So you did so great with the whole project.

SPEAKER_01 15:44

Yeah. I mean, I was like, what am I gonna do? Put the bag of stuff to get rid of back in the room, and that felt wrong.

unknown 15:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:51

And so I was like, oh, I knew my sister would take it. So I was like, please take this for me because everyone's in support of me getting this room clean. So uh yeah, that worked because that this is the room where we put stuff to get rid of. Like, I do have another bag of stuff somewhere in here that I started and it's just been in here, right? So I felt very wrong putting it back in here. And the bag of clothes I'm keeping to wash is not in this room, it's sitting out there. I'm like, I'm not putting it in here. Good. Our washer and dryer are broken right now. So I have to like I have to wait to be able to wash everything. So it's not coming back in here though.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

Good, good. Well, it's funny because what you're doing is you're aligning the energy in the room. Like this no longer fits here anymore. So I'm not gonna continue to store it here. There is something when we were setting the intention last call, you using it as a holding zone was not one of the intentions. I mean, it's a storage space, but if you're going to, I know that we talked about it holding things that you might sell, but it's not supposed to be like doing the hiding work for the rest of the house for you to be able to put your stuff here so you can really unfurl, yes. But I don't want you feeling like you have to take ownership of all of the house stuff that is in transition, you know. Yeah, definitely. Yeah, yeah. So do you feel like you want to jump into shoes next? So we can kind of work through and get the shoes resolved before we move on to the next step.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

The shoes let me show you. What I told myself and I was gonna do it last night, but I was too tired. I was like, I know I can at least pull out the shoes I know that I want for sure. And like I feel like that part's easy. But then there's a bunch of shoes. I'm like, I don't know. Do I sell these? Are these ones garbage? Are these ones I like I haven't worn some of them in so long, but I have big feet. I wear an 11 and a half women's, and that is a very weird size. And so when it comes to shoes, I'm a little bit uh clingy. Like I'm I have a hard time getting rid of shoes because it is really hard for me to find shoes that fit and are comfortable that I actually like. But that also means I have a bunch of shoes that I found in my size that I don't really love, but I bought them because they fit me.

SPEAKER_00 18:01

This is one of those places where organizing can be so much more complicated than just deciding do I want this or not. Because sometimes letting go of something actually creates more work. For Lainey, getting rid of a pair of shoes she doesn't love might mean having to find another pair in a hard-to-find size, ordering them, trying them on, returning what doesn't work, and suddenly getting rid of one thing has created a whole new project. And shoes are just one example. Sometimes we're holding on to something because it needs to be sold, repaired, returned, researched, replaced, or taken somewhere specific. There can be a whole list of things that we have to do before we actually can let something go. So sometimes the question isn't just do I want this? It's also what is getting rid of this going to require from me? And when we don't account for all of that extra work, it's really easy to look at a room like this and wonder why it's taking us so long. It's not just black and white. No, I guess I think like the readyware industry makes it so difficult for our bodies because it's so tough, especially for those of us who are in between or who have specific sizes. Like you can't shove your foot into a 10, you know, it really is tough when we have these things and it causes us to have this bigger attachment because, well, that's better than not having any shoes. I'd rather have these shoes and put them on for five minutes for a photo at a wedding than to have no shoes. I mean, and again, but it's tricky. And then the advice I would give somebody is well, let's find the best pair of shoes that you would wear to a wedding. But that's one, you're expecting the supply to have what you need, and two, the time that you need. And it's not important right now. And generally, when we are actually thinking about needing that special shoe, it's right before a wedding and we probably don't even have time to get it shipped. And it's very stressful. So one of the reasons why these projects are tricky because we could just do multiple sessions about shoes to make sure that you have the exact right shoes so you don't have to worry anymore. We beat ourselves up because we didn't get the room organized in three hours. When the truth is the shoes alone are not even a three-hour project. It's more like a 12-hour project that requires shopping and trying things on and going and getting fit. I feel like I can start the shoe job and we could do it now.

SPEAKER_01 20:18

And I could start by like pulling out the ones I know I want, but I also feel like I could get the majority of the sorting done on my own. And I feel like if there were some that I needed help with, I could like set those aside and maybe we could do something else more valuable today.

SPEAKER_00 20:37

I actually feel like you feel strong enough in clarity about what needs to be done. I feel fine leaving that with you. I think one of the things that I'm gonna leave you with though, as part of that project, is you are allowed to have a box of safety just in case shoes that you actually have no intention of wearing, but you're kind of anxious to get rid of. It is okay to not be ready to get rid of everything the minute you know it's not quite right.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

I feel like that's very helpful. And I kind of have done that without intentionally doing it. And so I like the idea of intentionally having that box, the hard question mark box.

SPEAKER_00 21:14

Yeah, because then we don't feel guilty about trying to make it all fit in our shoe rack or I need it close by. That can be up on a high shelf or down in a low part of the closet. You don't have to get rid of that stuff.

SPEAKER_01 21:26

I just want to feel comfortable and confident.

SPEAKER_00 21:30

Yeah, because if you're not comfortable in your shoes, it is actually miserable. It's really having shoes is like is super, super important. It's not even like, oh, I'm a princess who needs shoes. It's like you need them to function as a human and feel like you can chase your toddler and go to work. Keep the things out that you use all the time. Make a list, like an inventory of what do you need to have a complete set of shoes?

SPEAKER_01 21:52

I have all these shoes that I haven't worn in so long and I have such a hard time getting rid of shoes. And then I get more and I'm not getting rid of any. And I honestly don't know what that would even look like. A list of the shoes that I need. Like I've never thought about that. They've just always been there and they take up space, you know? I never thought about what do I need?

SPEAKER_00 22:14

Yeah. Okay, good. So that'll be your homework. What would be helpful for us to work on today? What is tough and tricky that we can do together?

SPEAKER_01 22:22

Um, I don't know. There's so much stuff in here.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

So when you're looking at this, is there anything that's easy to get rid of? Anything that you're like, I have been needing to donate this or I've been meaning to throw this away. Is there anything that's just like easy release? And if not, that's okay.

SPEAKER_01 22:41

I mean, there's I mean, there's definitely like some of these boxes are garbage. They're empty. This is just like we end up kind of throwing recycle boxes in here. Yeah. Um, and nothing is like coming up as easy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

So feel that wall that you just hit inside of yourself. Yeah. That's yeah. So there's a process that I like to do when a room feels this overwhelming. And it's what I define as triage. When a space is overwhelming and I know we're not going to be able to organize it quickly, I'll often do something that I call triage. The goal of triage isn't to organize the room, it's to make the room safer and more functional while it's still a work in progress. So we're clearing enough space to comfortably move through the room. We're making sure that things aren't stacked in a way that could topple over, and we're also trying to get a high-level sense of what's actually in here. In Lainey's case, we're going to be putting things in boxes and bags that can safely stack, and we're using painter's tape and a Sharpie to label approximately what's inside. That way, if she needs something before we get to that box, she has a reasonable chance of finding it. Because a room like this can take time to organize, and if we're going to be living with some chaos for a while, we need a strategy for being in the chaos, something that makes the space safer, more functional, and easier to live with while we do the deeper work over time. Essentially, what we're trying to do is we're trying to make it a functional space without actually making a lot of decisions or having to do the deep, long-lasting work. The problem is that things are stacked in a little precarious of a way. They're kind of teetering. There's things that are falling all over each other, and that makes it really stressful and hard. So, what I would like to do is to have you start to re-box things so that they can seal and stack.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

That sounds very helpful. Like I would love to do that. That makes me happy because I want my art supplies. Okay, so I feel like I have to move this out of the way. So the baby wipes have a place in another room. So that can go out here right now because I can put those away.

SPEAKER_00 24:42

Yeah. And actually, Lainey, if there are things that can be put into another room, put them there right now. Our primary focus right now is just making more space and making the room itself feel more functional and spacious without actually organizing anything really.

SPEAKER_01 24:55

I feel like normally what I would want to do with like the boxes of art supplies, because that's exciting for me and to be able to find stuff I've been looking for. Well, I would normally stop and get distracted and want to go through it and condense it and organize it, which is kind of hard not to do. Like I pulled it out, I was like, but there's still room for stuff in here. Like I want to go dig out another box and then condense it. But that's like a big distraction. That's just me wanting to do that, you know. Yeah. We're we're doing the triage, right?

SPEAKER_00 25:24

Yeah. The mantra in your mind that I want you to hear is no new projects, right? No new projects. I don't have to start no new projects.

SPEAKER_01 25:31

I wrote it down.

SPEAKER_00 25:32

No new projects.

SPEAKER_01 25:33

That's the big thing. Bag of cat food can go in the bathroom because the bucket it goes in is almost empty. I have a question. I grabbed the cat food and then I like put it in the bathroom and then I left it there. And I was like, wait, I should put it in the thing and then throw away the bag. Yeah. Because I don't want to have to go back and like see it or have, you know, somebody go use the bathroom and they can't because the bag of food is there. I'm like, okay. So as I'm moving stuff around, I know the right thing to do is to just like finish the job and like put it away.

SPEAKER_00 26:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:08

Part of me is like going around and just setting it there to do later. And like, what would you prefer?

SPEAKER_00 26:14

Do it right now. Yeah, do it completely. Because a lot of what's in this room is stuff that's halfway done, or you know what needs to be done, but you don't have time for it. So this is a great completion space. Like if you just completed the things that are in here, I would imagine that 70% of this room would be gone. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 26:32

So I'm taking the baby legs out of the box, putting them in the stage that they go in the closet. Yes. Put the cat food in the bucket that it goes in. Oh, there's more space here. Already. Already. More space.

SPEAKER_00 26:50

I don't know if you can tell, but it's there. I see it. That's a great one. You can walk, you can have a little dance party. Right.

SPEAKER_01 26:56

That feels good. I feel like there's gonna be stuff in these boxes as we're like cleaning in. Some of it is obviously keep, and then some of it is gonna be it's gonna be mixed together.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

So the way I see it, Lini, is if you have 70% accuracy, that's good enough for me. We're just trying to make space, trying to make the room more functional, make it feel less overwhelming. So I'm totally fine with it being imperfect. It doesn't have to be 100%. 70% is enough for me to feel like we are making progress and that you can breathe a little easier in that room. And how much more clear does the room feel now? How does it feel just having triaged it the way you did? I mean, it feels like there's some hope because there's a place for something. By the end of that session, we hadn't organized the room. That wasn't the goal. But Lainey could now move through it more easily. Things had started to make more sense, and most importantly, she finally was feeling some hope. From the outside, it looked like we were moving in the right direction. But when we met again, a different problem started to come into focus.

SPEAKER_01 27:56

I feel like I've been so busy. Our last time we talked, I did the shoes, and I feel like that's all I did. I guess I'm struggling because one finding the time and the motivation, come in here and work, it's still just like overwhelming. You know, and really the time like where it has to be time where my daughter's not really around because I put something in a box, she's gonna go take it out. So yeah, uh I feel like we've been busy too. And so much of the time when there's time we're all together, I just want to be with them. I don't want to do stuff. I want to be like, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 28:38

Yeah, you want to be a family or you want to take care of yourself. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Yeah. Oh, I would have loved to shower today, but I didn't prepare yet.

SPEAKER_00 28:47

You know, first things first, right? Yeah, yeah. Well, okay, so let's let's talk high-level strategy then because it sounds like that's going to help. A lot of people just beat themselves up when they're not making consistent progress. It's your second summer with your daughter, so of course you want to do summer things. Like you're never gonna have the summer again with her.

SPEAKER_01 29:07

Yeah, it's true. Yeah, and it's like these things that just it's like there's always something like I can't get everything done at all. And I'm already trying to find time to do normal tasks, like even just finding time to do that. So then trying to find time to do the organizing is like I'm still just trying to figure out how to take showers and clean the house up and do normal things, and I'm struggling with that, you know what I mean? Like yeah, it's hard. And it's nice because she's older, but in the same time, she's older, so she's getting into everything. She wants to be with me one-on-one all the time, and I just want to relax and get rest.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

Totally. When I hear you talk about what you're experiencing, like you are in the keeping your head above water stage. There's a lot of things that you're trying to work with, there's a lot of layers.

SPEAKER_01 30:03

Yeah, it kind of feels like like we're taking on the organizing of this room and physical things. But what feels like I should naturally be doing first is trying to organize my life, you know, and that's just something I have been trying to do. And I have been trying to like just having a morning routine with my daughter every day. Like I still don't even have that. And I printed out a routine, like I tried to make that and tried to get organized. Just having a consistent calendar and everything written on the calendar and having AHD and trying to organize my days, it's really hard because nothing is timed correctly, right? And it feels like I don't have time for anything. And so even when I try to organize it, it's all jumbled. It feels like jumbled chaos. And then trying to come in here and do this, it seems like it's out of order, right? Because I should, I feel like I should be prepared and ready for this task, but really I'm not.

SPEAKER_00 30:55

Yeah. And it may not be the right task for this moment. And that's okay. You're allowed to start something and realize it's not the right path. A lot of times we start in a room and then we uncover something that becomes the thing we have to solve before we can move forward. And that's normal. It's kind of like if if you broke your leg, you're not gonna paint your toenails. Your toenails might need to be painted. Like, you know, you're gonna address the broken leg. So it could be like that. And I think it's interesting if we even just pivot and say, okay, why don't we just focus on how can we update your routine? Like, what does it look like to have a routine? I appreciate that you're willing to do this and pivot. I think pivoting is necessary a lot of times if we just stick with like we're only doing the room. It doesn't really serve what's causing the clutter in the room because you're right, like the room feels good, but it's not giving you what you need quite yet. Yeah. When Lainey and I started working together, we thought we were organizing a storage room. And that room still does need to be organized. We haven't abandoned it. But sometimes organizing projects show you what need to come first. Lainey doesn't need another organizing project right now. She needs more support around her time, her routines, and taking care of herself. Because if there's barely enough time to take a shower or just get through the things that happen every day, finding hours to organize a storage room is probably not the place to start. So we're changing the plan. And I think there's something really important in that. Getting organized isn't about forcing yourself to finish the thing that you decided you were supposed to do. Sometimes getting organized means paying attention when something isn't working, getting curious about why, and choosing a different place to begin. For Lainey, making space for herself may not start by clearing this room. It may start by making a little bit more room for herself in her daily life. Thank you so much for spending time with us today. Every organizing session tells a different story, but they all leave us with one question. What are you making space for? As you move through your day, I hope you'll carry that question with you. Because getting organized isn't about creating a perfect home. It's about creating more room for the life you want to live. And if you're ready to start making space in your own life, I'd love to help. You can download a free copy of my book, Why the Am I Still Not Organized, at starhanson.com forward slash podcast, where you'll also find resources, classes, and ways we can work together. Until next time, keep making space for what matters most.